[22/10/24, 4:36:05 PM] John Tan: https://youtu.be/YRIrf7XzEnA?si=8n_tJtv9YD3jiLFx

 
[22/10/24, 4:36:39 PM] Yin Ling: 2 hours video lol
[22/10/24, 4:38:31 PM] John Tan: This YouTube interview on Federico faggin is really good.  He is trying so hard to connect his understanding of physics, computer design knowledge, quantum mechanics with his experience of consciousness.
[22/10/24, 4:41:48 PM] John Tan: You look at him and his expressions, so difficult to articulate the taste of consciousness radiance as qualia.

The critical point is the he really is able to "feel" the quantum state IS a description of the interiority of the world and he is trying so so hard to express that.
[22/10/24, 4:42:42 PM] Soh Wei Yu: Radiance as qualia is like anatta?
[22/10/24, 4:43:02 PM] John Tan: It is difficult to find one that really know physics that well and consciousness as a direct epxerience.
[22/10/24, 4:44:16 PM] John Tan: Part of it and in terms of intensity but not in terms of view.  But that is altogether a different matter.
[22/10/24, 4:44:42 PM] John Tan: Go watch.
[22/10/24, 4:44:50 PM] Soh Wei Yu: So his experience is like anatta but he dont too much about the view?
[22/10/24, 4:44:52 PM] Soh Wei Yu: Ok
[22/10/24, 4:45:01 PM] John Tan: In taste yes.


[22/10/24, 4:52:48 PM] John Tan: The other guy is Bernardo Kastrup is an analytical idealist, both r very Vedanta in view although I dun think they study them.  Both r scientists that r equiped with the required knowledge in physics and can relate to consciousness esp Federico.
[22/10/24, 4:52:59 PM] John Tan: In 2011, Faggin founded the Federico and Elvia Faggin Foundation to support the scientific study of consciousness at US universities and research institutes. In 2015, the Faggin Foundation helped to establish a $1 million endowment for the Faggin Family Presidential Chair in the Physics of Information at UC Santa Cruz to promote the study of "fundamental questions at the interface of physics and related fields including mathematics, complex systems, biophysics, and cognitive science, with the unifying theme of information in physics."[4]

[22/10/24, 5:48:53 PM] John Tan: Later Federico actually described experience of anatta and total exertion but he doesn't want to put a term or name to it like non-dual, no-self....etc

Nice video 

 

 

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Mr CG asked, "What stage you reckon Federico is at Soh Wei Yu?"

 

Soh replied, "Thusness Stage 1 and 2 https://www.awakeningtoreality.com/2007/03/thusnesss-six-stages-of-experience.html *

Having a direct realization of Consciousness with physicist background is rare and precious.

* https://besharamagazine.org/science-technology/consciousness-as-the-ground-of-being/

Federico: Well, in this theory, the quantum fields are the conscious entities. But the particles are not conscious because they don’t really exist as separate things; they are just states of those fields. They cannot be conscious because they do not have a unique identity.

Similarly, we think of ourselves as conscious bodies. But we are only conscious because our bodies are connected with conscious entities that exist in a vaster reality of which space–time reality is just a projection. So what I am – the real ‘me’ – lives in this vaster reality and it controls my body top-down. Our body is not conscious; it is made of electrons, protons, and so on, and it exists as information, as quantum-classical information. The simplest structure in the physical world that can host consciousness is a cell. Nothing less than a living cell can have its own consciousness in the sense that the physical structure can be controlled by a conscious entity.

Jane: So if we do not really exist in space time, but at the level of this vaster reality, physical death should not fundamentally disrupt our consciousness?

Federico: Yes, absolutely. We think that when the body dies, it is the end of our consciousness because we have been told that consciousness is produced by the brain. But as I said earlier, it is the other way around. It is the brain that is produced by consciousness. So consciousness uses the body as a tool to know itself.

Clearly our body is temporary, but we are not temporary because we exist outside space–time and we want to know ourselves. And we will continue to seek to know ourselves ever more, for, as I said earlier, the process will never end. Our identity may transform itself, but we never die. We are quantum entities, and a consequence of this model is the idea that we exist in what we might call ‘eternity’. When our body dies, we don’t go anywhere because, in a way, we never were ‘here’.

Richard: Could this idea not lead to a kind of fatalism. If I am not my body, and you are not your body, why should I look after you or care about you?

Federico: Well, if we are all part of a holistic One, how can we be separate from each other? If you experience yourself as the world that observes itself, you will directly know that you are me and I am you. So, it could never happen that I would not care about what happens to you because what happens to you also happens to me. But the only way to understand this is not intellectually. It can only occur through an experience of union, because until I had that experience of love, I could have said exactly what you just asked.

Richard: You had that extraordinary experience at Lake Tahoe and in the space of less than a minute, you knew things that you hadn’t known before. But does this mean that unless someone has a similar experience, they cannot understand fully what you are talking about?

Federico: In a way, yes. As embodied conscious entities we forget our true nature as soon as we identify with our bodies. Yet, when we experience our true nature again, we recognise ourselves in that experience. If you want to find out, open yourself up to finding out, and you will be given the experience by yourself and no one else. I believe it was the vaster ‘me’ who gave me the Lake Tahoe experience because I wanted to find out for no other reason than knowing – not because I wanted to make a computer out of it, or make money, or whatever. If you want to just know for knowing’s sake, you will come to know. Period."