John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:39am UTC+10
jax
must also know that the non-dual experience does not lost but become natural,
spontaneous and the intensity of luminosity heightened. Anatta is to eliminate
the trace to have total and vivid experience, not to hinder it.
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:41am UTC+10
there
will come a time where awareness is like standing out and the clarity becomes
unsurpassed it expanse without boundaries. This is very important.
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:42am UTC+10
That
is the transparency of awareness expanse way beyond ...
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:43am UTC+10
This
radiance can only arise in total effortlessness and spontaneity...
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:44am UTC+10
just
like substantialist non-dual in perfection
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:46am UTC+10
what
do u mean just like substantialist non-dual in perfection
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:46am UTC+10
it is
very difficult to explain
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:47am UTC+10
in a
mind body drop...there is no boundary..just pure sound, sensations...
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:48am UTC+10
rem
the last post i wrote and u told me it is just like non-dual awareness?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:49am UTC+10
u
closed ur eyes and u said u experienced like substantialist non-dual awareness?
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:50am UTC+10
u mean
then i fell asleep woke up etc?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:50am UTC+10
no
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:51am UTC+10
i told
u to contemplate about the 2 fold emptiness and i said emptiness has another
meaning for me...then i wrote for u ...u said u followed and feel like being a
substantial non-dual awareness?
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:51am UTC+10
yeah
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:52am UTC+10
then i
told u i experience the void awareness
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:52am UTC+10
like
snap out of the thought into the void awareness
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:52am UTC+10
then
fell asleep but woke up due to sinking back to a mirror
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:52am UTC+10
yeah
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:52am UTC+10
there
is nothing wrong with it...
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:54am UTC+10
there
is a very intense and much deeper state i assure u...but there is clear
understanding that the manifestation is it....however awareness is like an
unbounded and limitless expanse field
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:54am UTC+10
the
luminosity is intensely clear
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:55am UTC+10
so its
like boundless but as manifestation
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:55am UTC+10
and
vivid
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:55am UTC+10
not
exactly
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:56am UTC+10
the
experience is like Non-Dual Awareness broke lose and exist as a unbounded FIELD
John TanSunday,
April 28, 2013 at 1:57am UTC+10
there
is a difference in seeing sound and a hearer and realizing sound as awareness
itself
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:57am UTC+10
i
think i have told u before
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:58am UTC+10
Awareness
is like standing out
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:58am UTC+10
i
see..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:58am UTC+10
u
cannot focus and there cannot be any sense of effort
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:58am UTC+10
there
cannot be any sense of boundaries
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:59am UTC+10
does
focusing spoil the experience?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:59am UTC+10
just
itself
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:59am UTC+10
yes it
spoil the experience
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:59am UTC+10
u must
be very very stable and mature in the anatta state
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:59am UTC+10
just
like what i wrote in our blog
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 1:59am UTC+10
oic..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:00am UTC+10
maybe
taking lsd ppl experience that...lol
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:00am UTC+10
haha...
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:01am UTC+10
did i
tell u what the dj X experienced after ayahuasca?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:01am UTC+10
nope...who
is dj X?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:02am UTC+10
and u
cannot be in an enclosed room...
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:02am UTC+10
X, dj
X.. he's the 11th most famous dj in the world and got half a million fans in
his facebook page lol. he is doing self inquiry and converses with me
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:02am UTC+10
oic, u
cant experience that in enlosed room?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:02am UTC+10
ic
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:04am UTC+10
he
told me:
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:04am UTC+10
I had
a guy, a professional, who guided me.. We sat and he guided me with a short
meditation. After that, he asked me to drink the glass. He asked me to ask the
plant to be kind and to thank her, which I did. The adrenaline was rushing
through my body and I took a little moment with the glass in my hands and then
took it. The taste was disgusting. Bitter, sour, I don't know. haha. Then, he guided
me in a chakra meditation. He asked me to close my eyes and pointed that it
would be good to keep my eyes closed as much as possible during the journey. So
then we started, from the lowest chakra upwards. When we came to the heart
chakra, I think almost half an hour after drinking, I noticed that it started.
The blackness with my eyes closed started to get perspective and colors. It
started to come to life. Very quickly then, it became very very intense, like
being launched into a tunnel through space. With colors coming at me at an
enormous speed. I also felt somewhat sick at that moment. The voice of the guy
guiding me sounded like it was pitched down and vanished a bit to the
background. From sitting in lotus position, I lied down on the bed, on my back.
He continued with the meditation but I was completely taken by the experience
and a bit uncomfortable. When he finished I asked him if he had an advice, how
to get through this. He said: "Why? You don't need to do anything, just
let it go.. Let it go." He turned on the music, I decided at that moment
to completely let go and then the whole experience exploded into a beautiful
journey. At that moment peace fell over me and the music started guiding me.
There was almost no notion of the body already, everything was completely
taking place on a screen, taking up the whole experience. I first was
confronted with memories of my childhood, it showed me the moments that I felt
lonely and not loved. All the love that lacked when I was a child, was cured
and filled up at that moment. I started crying out of happiness. Crying so
much, but tears of joy. Also the notion of time was getting less and less. It
is very hard to say what happened when or how long it lasted. The music was
essential in the experience. Music has got a whole new meaning. I have no words
for how beautiful it was. Like it was telling the truth of the whole universe,
without words, just resonating on a different level. Then for a moment, I felt
like I was everything, the whole universe. I saw the night sky and there was
absolutely no feeling of being a human being. It was grande. I felt energy
rushing through the third eye, winding up, winding up and then releasing and
exploding, receiving light. Bright light, with diamond-like reflections. Then another
chakra in my belly started winding up and released, exploded and receiving
bright light. So intense and full of love. Then all that exploded into full
being-ness. An endless ocean of love. Ultimate happiness. This must have been
the happiest moment of my life. There were no events at that moment. Just light
and being and unconditional love. This was the climax of the experience. But it
was not over yet. After that a whole story began which was being witnessed. For
a moment I was experiencing being my father, my mother, my uncle, and going
through a certain situation in their life. I also for a moment was a gorilla
and a lion. Sometimes I remembered my question. "Who am I"? So I
asked it, but when I asked it I got the answer: "Who wants to know?"
I realized very well that the one that wants to know is that one that creates
the suffering. That is the one that can't accept not knowing and always wants
more. I felt that that was not me. At that moment I felt like a little chid who
was constantly overruled by his big brother. But the plant was inviting the
little child to come out to play and was unveiling the big brother's agenda.
Every time I asked the question the plant corrected me and got a little bit
upset for a moment. Then I realized who was asking and I surrendered again. I
felt guided throughout the experience. Guided by the plant? A higher power? I
don't know. Something was smiling at me. Letting me know that it was ok to let
go. I also remember having died. I was lowered into a coffin with grey hair and
my hands crossed on my chest. It was a very peaceful experience. Also I
remember some moments from my birth, difficult moment. I felt that the plant
was helping to resolve traumas. Sometimes I felt that it was focusing on the
physical body. It would for example lift a leg, start shaking it very rapid and
then released it. And later the other leg. Then an arm, the other arm. It was
releasing energy. The my right eye would started tearing very much. Later on my
left eye, and so on. Sometimes it would focus and a certain spot in the body
where there was a stress spot. It would focus on it until the stress was
released. And there would be no pain at that spot anymore. Sometimes the body
started gaping very loud too. When the effects started to wear off, which was a
slow process, I sometimes came back into the physical world for a moment and
then got pushed back into it. But when my first thoughts came up, one of the
first things that came up was a complete utter respect for this body. I was/am
so thankful to the body for having gone through all those years of suffering
and treating it badly with bad eating, smoking, drugs, alcohol etc. Also this
experience which was intense for the physical body. I thanked it deeply for it
and at that moment decided that I was going to treat the body like a temple.
Treat it with complete respect. This was definitely the most profound
experience of my life. The sense of self was gone mostly throughout the
experience. After the experience it came back, but I feel like it has released
a lot of negative energy and I have felt unconditional love like this for the
first time. I will definitely do it again in the future as I truly think it can
be of help on the path.
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:04am UTC+10
it is
difficult to experience in an enclosed room unless u r in deep samadhi
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:04am UTC+10
oic..
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:05am UTC+10
is
deep samadhi necessary or helpful
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:05am UTC+10
for
this experience?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:05am UTC+10
not
exactly, it is the effortlessness and crystal clear transparency and intensity
of luminosity...
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:08am UTC+10
but
duality must no more trouble the practitioner, phenomena is clearly understood
as the radiance...so nothing is obscuring then in total effortless and
emanation arises and the expanse just continues
Soh Wei
YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:10am UTC+10
ic..
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:10am UTC+10
should
i tell this to jax?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:13am UTC+10
i m
thinking how to tell him...since he just broke through...a person in such a
state is difficult to turn back That is why i wrote in the post and said
"it is empty"....and ask what does that emptiness mean
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:14am UTC+10
turn
back to ?
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:14am UTC+10
substantial
one mind?
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:15am UTC+10
but
u're not asking him to turn back to one mind view right, just refining the
anatta experience in certain way
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:15am UTC+10
from
substantial non-dual awareness
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:16am UTC+10
it is
different..if the intensity of experience is that strong
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:16am UTC+10
it is not
easy to lead one with such intensity of experience with mere intellectual
exchange
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:17am UTC+10
but i
doubt without right view and anatta, one can reach that state
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:17am UTC+10
u mean
that awareness field state?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:18am UTC+10
yes...in
experience it is like that
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:18am UTC+10
but u
said its similar to substantial one mind right
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:18am UTC+10
so one
mind people also experience it or not?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:18am UTC+10
u
don't get what i mean
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:19am UTC+10
one
mind is subsuming
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:19am UTC+10
therefore
there is a sense of dual
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:19am UTC+10
in
this case there isn't
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:20am UTC+10
oic..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:22am UTC+10
it is
like a drop of water landed on the surface of a clear ocean. the nature of
water and ocean are one and the same...nothing containing anything
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:24am UTC+10
when
sounds and music arise...they are like water and waves in ocean...everything is
it
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:25am UTC+10
when
the intensity is amplified many folds, it will not be easy for a practitioner
to overcome.
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:26am UTC+10
overcome?
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:26am UTC+10
so its
like
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:26am UTC+10
one
oceanic happening-awareness
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:27am UTC+10
?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:32am UTC+10
hm...was
reading what u send me about X's ayahuasca.
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:32am UTC+10
The
intensity of experience is there.
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:34am UTC+10
yes
oceanic happening-awareness
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:34am UTC+10
oic..
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:34am UTC+10
so is
wilhem experience like what u said?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:35am UTC+10
mine
is very much under controlled...lol...the intensity is there
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:36am UTC+10
it is
a very natural and effortless state
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:36am UTC+10
his is
like out of control...lol
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:36am UTC+10
lol..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:39am UTC+10
when
the mind is so confused about the background and the phenomena, such intense
experience will not arise unless probably with the help of such drug
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:39am UTC+10
oic..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:41am UTC+10
but
one is purified of the deep dualistic/inherent tendencies, the experience will
surface and become a natural and effortless state.
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:42am UTC+10
ic..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:42am UTC+10
there
must not be any sense of twoness...just what is...and it must be completely
effortless...spontaneous arising...
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:44am UTC+10
therefore
u must spend quality hours in such non-dual mode in walking, seeing,
tasting...no effort but fully just this dimensionless suchness as appearance
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:44am UTC+10
now u
r having too much thoughts
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:46am UTC+10
oic..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:50am UTC+10
I have
told u in the post commenting the rainbow body: Now penetration of the 3 states
is only supported by the strength of your view and realization, not by the
intensity of your non-conceptual experience.
[Soh:
Referring to this - Rainbow
Body and Thusness's Advice to Me]
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:52am UTC+10
ic..
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:53am UTC+10
btw u
said focus will spoil the experience
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:53am UTC+10
that
means it can only be experienced in a meditative setting?
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:53am UTC+10
cos
daily life requires focus to do task isnt it
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:53am UTC+10
like
right now dont u need some focus to see, type etc
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:55am UTC+10
no
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:56am UTC+10
there
is no need for meditative setting...it is the result of the dissolution of
deeply held tendencies. But u r not allowing the conditions to manifest
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:58am UTC+10
all
will simply arise spontaneously ....it is u must be out and have quality
experience on scenery, music, scent...etc...have a not so enclose and cooling
environment...
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 2:59am UTC+10
yah
just now i was walking outside awareness/experience is expansive and boundless
but not sure if its like what u said
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:00am UTC+10
one
way to help is to emanate out
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:00am UTC+10
what u
mean by emanate out
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:01am UTC+10
means
awareness kept expanding...
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:02am UTC+10
just
keep practicing expanding...open, emanate
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:03am UTC+10
yes..
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:03am UTC+10
even
in dream i experience that
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:03am UTC+10
then
it becomes transparent and expansive and nondual
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:03am UTC+10
few
days ago i also experience it
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:04am UTC+10
don't
focus on the intensity of luminosity, but expand to dissolve the center, the
core...keep expanding...the intensity of luminosity will naturally be
there....not to focus on luminosity
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:04am UTC+10
its
strange i dont know if what i experience is sleep paralysis... its just dark
and i keep expanding until i feel like floaty
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:04am UTC+10
but
later woke up
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:04am UTC+10
but
theres this strange feeling like i'm going to fall off the bed or something, i
think hallucination
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:04am UTC+10
yes in
waking state is also needed
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:05am UTC+10
in
waking state when walking outside its quite easy
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:05am UTC+10
like u
said
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:06am UTC+10
at hm
when u meditate...listen to music....musics that relates to the sound nature
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:07am UTC+10
oic..
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:10am UTC+10
anyway
don't chase after experiences...sever the center. The purpose is to tell jax it
is a refinement of his view so that he can perfect his non-dual state.
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:10am UTC+10
oic..
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:10am UTC+10
u tell
him ah, i dunno how to tell him :P
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:13am UTC+10
yes
when the time is right....
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:13am UTC+10
lol
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:13am UTC+10
lol
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:15am UTC+10
din
has undergone so much confusion that now the refuge is in the Awareness...lol
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:16am UTC+10
lol
Soh
Wei YuSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:16am UTC+10
its
like what u said regarding fear of establishing view?
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:19am UTC+10
yes
but because
John
TanSunday, April 28, 2013 at 3:19am UTC+10
yes
but because what that led him out of confusion is the understanding that all
these are mind stories, so that becomes his outlet but it is also the condition
that prevents his further seeking.