Deep Dive: A Comparative Look at Dzogchen and Non-dual Shaiva Tantra

In a recent episode of the Tantra Illuminated podcast, Dr. Christopher Wallis (Hareesh) sat down with Ācārya Malcolm Smith for a rigorous and illuminating conversation. While the title of the episode suggests a simple comparison, the dialogue quickly evolves into a deep dive into the nuances of Dzogchen (Great Perfection) and Non-dual Shaiva Tantra (specifically the Krama lineage).

Malcolm Smith, a veteran of a three-year solitary Tibetan Buddhist retreat and a renowned translator, brings a wealth of knowledge regarding the Dzogchen tradition. Together with Dr. Wallis, they explore where these two profound traditions intersect, where they diverge, and how they view the ultimate nature of reality.

Here are the key takeaways and memorable quotes from this fascinating exchange.

The Guest: From Industrial Music to Ācārya

Malcolm Smith’s journey is as fascinating as his scholarship. Starting as an industrial musician in the 1980s, he was eventually stopped in his tracks by the philosophy of Nāgārjuna. This led him away from theistic traditions and toward the logical rigor of Buddhism. Today, he is a highly respected teacher and translator of the Tibetan Buddhist tradition, specifically the "Great Perfection."

The Central Tension: Creation vs. Completion

One of the primary distinctions Smith draws early in the conversation is the difference between "Normative Vajrayana" and Dzogchen regarding practice.

• Normative Vajrayana: Often relies on the "Creation Stage"—visualizing oneself as a deity and the world as a mandala to purify perception. The idea is to "cure concepts with concepts."

• The Dzogchen View: Rejects the idea that you can cure concepts with more concepts. Instead, it emphasizes the "Completion Stage" or Trekchö—resting in the nature of mind without the need for elaborate visualization.

Understanding "Trekchö": Falling Apart, No Self

A highlight of the conversation is the linguistic correction regarding the Dzogchen term Trekchö. While often translated as "Cutting Through," Smith explains that the term actually refers to a bundle (like a sheaf of wheat) coming undone.

This is critical because it removes the "agent." There is no one cutting the ego.

• The Insight: The practice is not an active "cutting" by a self; rather, it is the natural falling apart or unraveling of the construct of the self.

• The Krama Parallel: Dr. Wallis notes a striking parallel in the Shaiva Krama lineage. When one sees through the illusory construct of independent selfhood, the "bundle" of the self naturally unravels, leaving only a flux of phenomena.

The Mechanics of Delusion: The Five Lights

Both traditions agree that understanding how delusion arises is vital to liberation. Smith provides a precise Dzogchen account involving the "five lights of pristine consciousness." Delusion is not a sin; it is a mistake of recognition.

"We fall into delusion because we become attached to the five lights of pristine consciousness, which we reify as the five vāyus and the five elements."

He explains that what we perceive as the coarse elements of the world are actually misperceived aspects of our own nature:

"Padmasambhava says... these compounded phenomena are actually uncompounded because our experience of the five elements is just due to our not recognizing the nature of the five elements as the five lights of pristine consciousness."

The "Big Secret": Direct Perception

Smith argues that what distinguishes Dzogchen from all other systems is the claim that you can have a Direct Perception (Dharmatā Pratyakṣa) of your own wisdom (jñāna) as a visual experience, without it being an object separate from you.

"No other system in the world says you can directly experience your jñāna as a visual object with your eyes, and achieve liberation in that way."

This is not about a self looking at a light; it is about the thigle rigpa (awareness bindu) becoming manifest.

"Direct perception of this thigle rigpa that exists in the center of your body, whose light can be projected based on certain secondary conditions through the eyes. And then you work with integrating with this light... That's how you get rainbow body."

Ontology: Resting in Diversity

Perhaps the most important distinction Smith makes is regarding "oneness." He clarifies that while Dzogchen is non-dual, it does not reify a single cosmic Self or "One" that we all merge into. There is no underlying "Self" to be found.

"There also isn't any 'one'. There's no one out there to become something part of. We use the term diversity. Then you're just left resting in diversity."

Even in this state of realization, specific perception remains intact. One is free to experience "trees as trees" without reification or grasping:

"All we experience is just diverse appearances that in our own experience, we recognize as just being the expression of the Shakti... of our own consciousness... We just enjoy the variety and rest in that."

The "Guarantee" of Liberation

The conversation closes with a bold assertion regarding the efficacy of the path. Smith notes the "triumphalist" nature of the text, which promises that understanding the lack of an inherent self and the mechanism of delusion is the key to ending suffering.

"Whoever enters the door of Dzogchen teachings, they're guaranteed you will never take rebirth in the three realms again."

Conclusion

Whether you are a student of Buddhism or Shaivism, this deep comparative dive serves as a reminder that these ancient lineages are not just collections of beliefs, but precise technologies.

For the full technical breakdown and to hear the rapport between these two scholars, watch the full episode on the Tantra Illuminated YouTube channel.