Showing posts with label Ethics. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Ethics. Show all posts[0]=AZWCSDvyMeayBhlj9-4nmkz92cnXzeOJCBTDO052vkbG3IeDJAXxFxZADRQ-rLzTXYeExtFCmYjBPmc0GM45MaqHjWh5fx_grhqvQp-sxL7q3H3jc938_aqMuB1QVPTUtF55fwG9p3mDN3YiQpF4gjqHY365fyjJXyh7AsDymqqtlTE5GgEypZcp4LFPGsghQc4&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-R

Where does ethics fit into all of this? Right and wrong are simply concepts, they don't actually exist, and there is no objective moral framework at all. However, no matter how deep your insight may be - even if there is not the subtlest form of self remaining, there still seems to be some sort of moral framework by which you/or by which spontaneous action takes place!
If you were a Nazi german officer in a concentration camp during WW2 and you had a huge realization of no self, would you stop what you are doing? And if so why? And also, if you didn't stop doing it, what would be wrong with that?
I have spoken to people before who claim to have the full realization of no self, and who say that they just play along with morality as if it was some sort of game - there is nothing actually happening at all, and people dying or being tortured is one with a sunrise - but they play the game, anyway. I dont know if anyone else has any better answers than that, or good resources on this. But, it seems like ethics should be an intricate part of all of this, as Gregg Good wrote in his book after awareness.
The conditioning of the body may still remain after awakening, but what is wrong with that conditioned body performing bad acts?
    Rick Indie
    A quote from Longchenpa Buddha's "Finding Rest in the Nature of Mind" :
    "By love, is anger driven out;
    The sambhogakaya and mirrorlike wisdom
    Are completely gained.
    The sambhogakaya is adorned
    With all the marks, both great and small, of buddhahood.
    By compassion, clinging love is banished;
    The dharmakaya and the all-discerning wisdom
    Are achieved.
    The dharmakaya is endowed
    With strengths, distinctive qualities, and so forth.
    Sympathetic joy removes all jealousy;
    The nirmanakaya and the sublime wisdom
    All-accomplishing are gained.
    The nirmanakaya is manifold with various forms.
    Its enlightened action is spontaneously accomplished.
    Impartiality removes both pride and ignorance.
    The svabhavikakaya is made manifest together with
    The wisdom of equality, the wisdom of the dharmadhatu.
    The svabhavikakaya is the dharmata
    Beyond conceptual elaboration.
    Therefore love, compassion, joy, & impartiality(The Four Immeasurables) are of unbounded excellence, and highly praised
    By the unequaled Teacher of both gods and humankind.
    [End quote]
    It sounds to me like you were talking to people who erred into a type of dullness/depersonalization via too much dhyana-meditation probably.
    The thing about morals and emotions is that they arent separate from buddha nature; they are part of the energy-body of a mindstream, so it's false to assume emotions get completely annihilated when you find realization; realization unleashes a different type of emotional-energetic state; a state of the Four Immeasurables.
    These Four Immeasurables are part of the "distinctive qualities" of the dharmakaya that Longchenpa Buddha described above. TRUE realization spontaneously &naturally compels a mindstream to exude actions & morals that are compassionate, which automatically leads to a certain moral code anyway; and you enact this code NOT because you were simply told to enact it, but because you directly, experientially know the truth of why its the most beneficial code. Its like how a river naturally comes rushing out once its no longer oppressed by a dam.
    It may take training to get there initially, but true realization frees you so that moralistic compassion finally expresses itself freely, spontaneously, and naturally. These compassionate morals will naturally radiate through you as a result of gradually exhausting the Three Poisons, and also as a result of breaking free from emotional dullness.

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    Yin Ling
    Rick Indie yes the above in OP is a nihilistic thinking. It’s the most dangerous amongst all dangers in the spiritual path.

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  • Yin Ling
    This is an important question, I am glad you asked.
    No self is the nature of reality. In Buddhism the deepest aspect of no self is equivalent to no inherent existence, or better known as emptiness.
    No self is not something you created and impute on top of reality or choose to believe. It is the nature, like how our body digest food naturally.
    So it’s not like, oh I realise no self, so there’s no one there to be responsible for anything.
    Knowing that, whatever is happening in our world now DO NOT change. It’s only the nature that we realise correctly.
    if you plant an apple seed, you get an apple tree.
    You don’t study for exams, you fail.
    You jump into cold water, you freeze.
    You act stupid and scream at your partner, the marriage will break up.
    Cause and effects are tenable, because of no inherent existence/emptiness, this is key. This is a super extremely important statement, you have to digest it slowly.
    So when one really understand no self, realise it, one will understand how cause and effect will contribute to the manifestation of this appearance that is “not truly there”…
    This is the way the “not truly there” display manifest- they manifest dependently on cause and conditions, do you follow?
    So these ppl who realise no-self in terms of no inherent existence and really understood dependent arising, they will respect cause and condition even more. They will know if they want a better “display” , they need to apply better conditions which will manifest that display. Like how you fertilise and water your soil to manifest a beautiful flower which has “no self”.
    The body is still there as long as we r human, I kinda want a roof above my head and not be too poor whilst this human “display” will go on?
    I also don’t really want to have a new “hell” display in my next life because my practice is not mature to the extent I can go to hell to help without fear yet.
    So I respect karma, cause and conditions. I don’t even dare have an evil thought knowing that will eventually manifest in something quite troublesome for me, let alone actions that are harmful.
    That’s my opinion:)

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  • Soh Wei Yu
    Very well said

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