Soh:
The understanding of Nirvana in the different schools of Buddhism
Just
saw Geoff (nana/jnana) wrote a great informative post explaining the
different understanding of Nirvana in the various Hinayana or Mahayana
traditions of Buddhism:
"For
the Theravāda, nibbāna is an ultimately real dhamma (paramatthadhamma)
and the only dhamma that is not conditioned (asaṅkhata). It is an object
of supramundane cognition (lokuttaracitta) and is included in the
mental phenomena sensory sphere (dhammāyatana) and the mental phenomena
component (dhammadhātu). The four paths, four fruits, and nibbāna are
classified as the unincluded level (apariyāpanna bhūmi), that is, not
included in the sensual realm, the form realm, or the formless realm.
According to the Visuddhimagga, nibbāna "has peace as its
characteristic. Its function is not to die; or its function is to
comfort. It is manifested as the signless; or it is manifested as
non-diversification (nippapañca)."
According
to the Sarvāstivāda, nirvāṇa is an analytical cessation
(pratisaṃkhyānirodha) that is a disjunction from impure dharmas that
occurs through analysis (pratisaṃkhyāna), which is a specific type of
discernment (prajñā). This analytical cessation is substantially
existent (dravyasat) and ultimately exists (paramārthasat).
For
Sautrāntika commentators nirvāṇa as an analytical cessation
(pratisaṃkhyānirodha) is a merely a conceptual designation (prajñapti)
and doesn't refer to an entity or state that is substantially existent
(dravyasat). It is a non-implicative negation (prasajyapratiṣedha), that
is, a negation that doesn't imply the presence of some other entity.
Therefore nirvāṇa simply refers to a cessation that is the termination
of defilements that are abandoned by the correct practice of the noble
path.
According
to the Yogācāra, for those on the bodhisattva path, nirvāṇa is
non-abiding (apratiṣṭha nirvāṇa). The dependent nature
(paratantrasvabhāva) is the basis (āśraya) of both defilement and
purification. The all-basis consciousness (ālayavijñāna) is the defiled
portion (saṃkleśabhāga) of the dependent nature. Purified suchness
(viśuddhā tathatā) is the purified portion (vyavadānabhāga) of the
dependent nature. Synonyms for purified suchness are the perfected
nature (pariniṣpanna) and non-abiding nirvāṇa. Non-abiding nirvāṇa is
the revolved basis (āśrayaparāvṛtti) that has eliminated defilements
without abandoning saṃsāra.
Madhyamaka
authors accept the notion of non-abiding nirvāṇa, but they don't use
the three natures model used by the Yogācāra. Rather, they simply
consider all things to be conceptual designations (prajñapti) that are
empty of nature (svabhāva). For them, conceptual designations are
relative truth (saṃvṛtisatya) and only emptiness is ultimate truth
(paramārthasatya).
Zen,
Pure Land, Vajrayāna, etc., are practice traditions more so than
doctrinal schools, and authors writing from any of these perspectives
would generally rely on Yogācāra or Madhyamaka śāstras or a specific
Mahāyāna sūtra."
Dmytro asked: "Hi Ñāṇa,
And how you would put the Buddha's description of Nibbana in relation to said above?"
Geoff replied: "Given
the definition given in SN 38.1, SN 43.1-44, and Abhidhamma Vibhaṅga
184, I would say that it's a designation (paññatti, prajñapti) referring
to the elimination of passion, aggression, and delusion. Or with regard
to the four paths (stream-entry, etc.), a designation referring to the
elimination of fetters terminated by each path. This is similar to the
Sautrāntika interpretation."
I
concur. Sautrantika has the closest understanding of Nirvana to the
original teachings of Buddha, which I shall elaborate in the comments
section.
Unlike · · Unfollow Post · March 6 at 2:39am near Brisbane, Queensland
Seen by 175
You like this.
Soh: Some weeks ago I also wrote something elsewhere:
"Nagarjuna
wrote in his seventy verses that rejected Nirvana as a true existence
or as the annihilation of a real being or entity: #24.
Opponent:
If there is no origination and cessation, then to the cessation of what
is nirvana due? Reply: Is not liberation this: that by nature nothing
arises and ceases?
.
#25.
If
nirvana [resulted] from cessation, [then there would be] destruction.
If the contrary, [there would be] permanence. Therefore it is not
logical that nirvana is being or non-being."
Not
only does the Aṣṭasāhasrikāprajñapāramitā Sutra talk about Nirvana as
illusory, the Samadhiraja Sutra also says 'The ultimate truth is like a
dream; And nirvana is similarly like a dream. The wise take them that
way And this is the supreme discipline of mind" and "When the
bodhisattva addresses these things: The truth of cessation is like a
dream, Nirvana also is essentially a dream; That is called the
discipline of speech."
Some
Theravadins have a slightly eternalistic interpretation of Nibbana. In
the past, the Sautrantika (which was even much more popular than
Theravada until it died out in India along with the whole of Buddhism in
general, leaving Theravada in other countries like Sri Lanka etc) which
follows the Buddha's teachings or suttas more to the letter would
strictly define nirvana in terms of cessation or elimination of fetters.
Which is what the Buddha taught that Nirvana is. An eternalistic
interpretation of Nirvana as some ultimately existing reality has no
basis at all in the Pali canon/Buddha's words which clearly defined in
so many instances that Nirvana, not-conditioned, not-born, death-free
and so on are simply synonyms for the "elimination of passion,
aggression and delusion". (reference:
http://sgforums.com/forums/1728/topics/447451)
The
analogy given by the Buddha on Nirvana is a fire going out - and
Nirvana simply means cessation, termination, gone out, etc. And with
cessation there is no remainder of any kind of being or existence, nor
could it be understood in terms of non-being, both or neither.
"Even
in the Vedic period there was the dilemma between `being' and
`non-being'. They wondered whether being came out of non-being, or
non-being came out of being. Katham asataþ sat jàyeta, "How could being
come out of non-being?"[23] In the face of this dilemma regarding the
first beginnings, they were sometimes forced to conclude that there
was neither non-being nor being at the start, nàsadàsãt no sadàsãt
tadànãm.[24] Or else in the confusion they would sometimes leave the
matter unsolved, saying that perhaps only the creator knew about it.
All
this shows what a lot of confusion these two words sat and asat, being
and non-being, had created for the philosophers. It was only the Buddha
who presented a perfect solution, after a complete reappraisal of the
whole problem of existence. He pointed out that existence is a fire kept
up by the fuel of grasping, so much so that, when grasping ceases,
existence ceases as well.
In
fact the fire simile holds the answer to the tetralemma included among
the ten unexplained points very often found mentioned in the suttas.
It concerns the state of the Tathàgata after death, whether he exists,
does not exist, both or neither. The presumption of the questioner is
that one or the other of these four must be and could be answered in
the affirmative.
The
Buddha solves or dissolves this presumptuous tetralemma by bringing in
the fire simile. He points out that when a fire goes out with the
exhaustion of the fuel, it is absurd to ask in which direction the fire
has gone. All that one can say about it, is that the fire has gone out:
Nibbuto tveva saïkhaü gacchati, "it comes to be reckoned as `gone
out'."[25]
It
is just a reckoning, an idiom, a worldly usage, which is not to be
taken too literally. So this illustration through the fire simile
drives home to the worldling the absurdity of his presumptuous
tetralemma of the Tathàgata.
In the Upasãvasutta of the Pàràyaõavagga of the Sutta Nipàta we find the lines:
Accã yathà vàtavegena khitto,
atthaü paleti na upeti saïkhaü,
"Like the flame thrown out by the force of the wind
Reaches its end, it cannot be reckoned."[26]
Here
the reckoning is to be understood in terms of the four propositions of
the tetralemma. Such reckonings are based on a total misconception of
the phenomenon of fire.
It
seems that the deeper connotations of the word Nibbàna in the context
of pañicca samuppàda were not fully appreciated by the commentators.
And that is why they went in search of a new etymology. They were too
shy of the implications of the word `extinction'. Probably to avoid the
charge of nihilism they felt compelled to reinterpret certain key
passages on Nibbàna. They conceived Nibbàna as something existing out
there in its own right. They would not say where, but sometimes they
would even say that it is everywhere. With an undue grammatical
emphasis they would say that it is on coming to that Nibbàna that lust
and other defilements are abandoned: Nibbànaü àgamma ràgàdayo khãõàti
ekameva nibbànaü ràgakkhayo dosakkhayo mohakkhayo ti vuccati.[27]
But
what do we find in the joyous utterances of the theras and therãs who
had realized Nibbàna? As recorded in such texts as Thera- and
Therã-gàthà they would say: Sãtibhåto'smi nibbuto, "I am grown cool,
extinguished as I am."[28] The words sãtibhåta and nibbuta had a cooling
effect even to the listener, though later scholars found them
inadequate.
Extinction
is something that occurs within an individual and it brings with it a
unique bliss of appeasement. As the Ratanasutta says: Laddhà mudhà
nibbutiü bhu¤jamànà, "they experience the bliss of appeasement won free
of charge."[29] Normally, appeasement is won at a cost, but here we
have an appeasement that comes gratis." ~ Venerable Nanananda,
http://www.beyondthenet.net/calm/nibbana01.htm"
The Meaning of Nirvana - SgForums.com
sgforums.com
This
type of blackout cessation is experienced by all sorts of yogis
including those practicing non-Buddhist systems. Thus, it has nothing to
do with the correct engagement of vipassanā. The cessation of
unsatisfactoriness (dukkhanirodha) is the cessation of craving (taṇhā),
not the cessation of phe...[Preview cut off]
March 6 at 2:41am · Like · Remove Preview
Soh:
That being said, I do not see contradiction between Buddha's
understanding of Nirvana and Yogacara's understanding of 'perfected
suchness' (especially when we take into consideration the Buddha's
teaching on suchness such as Kalaka Sutta). The notion of eliminating
defilements yet not abandoning samsara is however a Mahayana development
(which does not however contradict the Buddha's early teachings insofar
as it does not present a substantialist understanding of Nirvana,
especially for Madhyamika).
March 6 at 2:49am · Edited · Like
................
RB wrote: I read the links on your blog. I'd have to disagree as would many
theravadins. It's clear and I could cite passage after passage from the
Suttas referencing Nibbana as an element, a dhamma, or as the
unconditioned etc. Of course that isn't negating the passages from the
articles on your site indicating that Nibbana is the destruction of the
taints. I'm not convinced that NIbbana is ONLY the ending of the
defilements.
Soh Wei Yu
Nirvana is of course a dharma, and it is not conditioned.
Specifically,
nirvana is the destruction of taints and is not conditioned. Nirvana
simply means extinction, cessation, of those afflictions, and nothing
else.
The knowledge of nibbana is precisely
described by Buddha as the third knowledge, the knowledge of the
destruction of the cankers.
There are only two other types of not conditioned dharma.
Arcaya Malcolm:
“Just
how many unconditioned (saṃskrita) dharmas do you think there are? By
my count, there are only three: space and the two cessations. Space has
no function at all, and neither do the two cessations. Space never
changes, it is permanent. Cessations never change, they are permanent.
Emptiness also has no "function." Emptiness is also permanent and changeless.
Space, cessation, and emptiness also are not real so their permanence is merely a formal statement.
Only conditioned dharmas have "functions."” 
Soh Wei Yu Keep in mind that Buddha also said:
Buddha: "SN 43 Asaṅkhata Saṃyutta (1-44 combined & abridged):
And what, monks, is the not-fabricated (asaṅkhata)? The elimination
of passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the not-fabricated.
And what,
monks, is the not-inclined (anata)? The elimination of passion, the
elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called
the not-inclined.
And what, monks, is the
outflowless (anāsava)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the outflowless.
And what, monks, is the truth (sacca)? The elimination of passion,
the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is
called the truth.
And what, monks, is the
farther shore (pāra)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the farther
shore.
And what, monks, is the subtle (nipuṇa)?
The elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the
elimination of delusion: this is called the subtle.
And what, monks, is the very hard to see (sududdasa)? The
elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination
of delusion: this is called the very hard to see.
And what, monks, is the unaging (ajajjara)? The elimination of
passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the unaging.
And what, monks, is
the stable (dhuva)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the stable.
And what, monks, is the undisintegrating (apalokita)? The
elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination
of delusion: this is called the undisintegrating.
And what, monks, is the non-indicative (anidassana)? The elimination
of passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the non-indicative.
And what,
monks, is the unproliferated (nippapañca)? The elimination of passion,
the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is
called the unproliferated.
And what, monks, is
the peaceful (santa)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the peaceful.
And what, monks, is the death-free (amata)? The elimination of
passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the death-free.
And what, monks,
is the sublime (paṇīta)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the sublime.
And what, monks, is the auspicious (siva)? The elimination of
passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the auspicious.
And what, monks,
is the secure (khema)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the secure.
And what, monks, is the elimination of craving (taṇhākkhaya)? The
elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination
of delusion: this is called the elimination of craving.
And what, monks, is the wonderful (acchariya)? The elimination of
passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the wonderful.
And what, monks,
is the amazing (abbhuta)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the amazing.
And what, monks, is the calamity-free (anītika)? The elimination of
passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the calamity-free.
And what,
monks, is the dhamma free of calamity (anītikadhamma)? The elimination
of passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion:
this is called the dhamma free of calamity.
And
what, monks, is extinguishment (nibbāna)? The elimination of passion,
the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is
called extinguishment.
And what, monks, is the
unafflicted (abyāpajjha)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the
unafflicted.
And what, monks, is dispassion
(virāga)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the
elimination of delusion: this is called dispassion.
And what, monks, is purity (suddhi)? The elimination of passion, the
elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called
purity.
And what, monks, is freedom (mutti)? The
elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the elimination
of delusion: this is called freedom.
And what,
monks, is the unadhesive (anālaya)? The elimination of passion, the
elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called
the unadhesive.
And what, monks, is the island
(dīpa)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the
elimination of delusion: this is called the island.
And what, monks, is the cave (leṇa)? The elimination of passion, the
elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called
the cave.
And what, monks, is the shelter
(tāṇa)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of aggression, the
elimination of delusion: this is called the shelter.
And what, monks, is the refuge (saraṇa)? The elimination of passion,
the elimination of aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is
called the refuge.
And what, monks, is the
destination (parāyana)? The elimination of passion, the elimination of
aggression, the elimination of delusion: this is called the
destination." - SN 43 Asaṅkhata Saṃyutta - more in http://measurelessmind.ca/pariyosana.html Soh Wei Yu And importantly, since you mentioned about 'element':
This, bhikkhu, is a designation for the element of Nibbāna: the removal of lust, the removal of hatred, the removal of delusion.
Nibbānadhātuyā kho etaṃ, bhikkhu, adhivacanaṃ: ‘rāgavinayo dosavinayo mohavinayo’ti.
https://suttacentral.net/sn45.7/en/bodhi
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