Today
Soh:
Hi, i think this will interest you on spiritual awakening : http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2007/03/thusnesss-six-stages-of-experience.html
Mr. E:
Thank you, I appreciate the link.
I am definitely in acknowledgement and aware of these understandings, I like some of the processes they explain though in regards to Emptiness.
There’s a stage of “true emptiness” that’s incomprehensible to an extent, because it seems to be absent of even the duality of Emptiness and Somethingness, because that sort of emptiness that is the counterpart of somethingness is still experiential by consciousness.
Whereas that “true emptiness” is consciousness turning into itself to the point that it transcends the duality and there’s only _____, but even then it’s incomprehensible and unnameable, so what I’m saying doesn’t do it justice besides being a sign post of some sort
What are your thoughts?
Soh:
consciousness turning into itself nondually is what i call the I AM
it is a crucial and precious realization
excerpt from http://www.awakeningtoreality.com/2019/01/no-awareness-does-not-mean-non.html
In 2009:
“(10:49 PM) Thusness: by the way you know about hokai description and "I AM" is the same experience?
(10:50 PM) AEN: the watcher right
(10:52 PM) Thusness: nope. i mean the shingon practice of the body, mind, speech into one.
(10:53 PM) AEN: oh thats i am experience?
(10:53 PM) Thusness: yes, except that the object of practice is not based on consciousness. what is meant by foreground? it is the disappearance of the background and whats left is it. similarly the "I AM" is the experience of no background and experiencing consciousness directly. that is why it is just simply "I-I" or "I AM"
(10:57 PM) AEN: i've heard of the way people describe consciousness as the background consciousness becoming the foreground... so there's only consciousness aware of itself and thats still like I AM experience
(10:57 PM) Thusness: that is why it is described that way, awareness aware of itself and as itself.
(10:57 PM) AEN: but you also said I AM people sink to a background?
(10:57 PM) Thusness: yes
(10:57 PM) AEN: sinking to background = background becoming foreground?
(10:58 PM) Thusness: that is why i said it is misunderstood. and we treat that as ultimate.
(10:58 PM) AEN: icic but what hokai described is also nondual experience rite
(10:58 PM) Thusness: I have told you many times that the experience is right but the understanding is wrong. that is why it is an insight and opening of the wisdom eyes. there is nothing wrong with the experience of I AM". did i say that there is anything wrong with it?
(10:59 PM) AEN: nope
(10:59 PM) Thusness: even in stage 4 what did I say?
(11:00 PM) AEN: its the same experience except in sound, sight, etc
(11:00 PM) Thusness: sound as the exact same experience as "I AM"... as presence.
(11:00 PM) AEN: icic
(11:00 PM) Thusness: yes”
“"I AM" is a luminous thought in samadhi as I-I. Anatta is a realization of that in extending the insight to the 6 entries and exits.” – John Tan, 2018
after that key to its full blown effortless unfolding and maturity is to bring it to the foreground in all manifestations and contemplate to realise anatta
for me the crucial thing after I AM is by focusing on the two stanzas of anatta and the four aspects of I AM as well as the two nondual contemplations
these brought me and many others to the next breakthrough
about 40+ people in the ATR community been through these phases and breakthroughts to anatta and emptiness
https://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2009/03/on-anatta-emptiness-and-spontaneous.html
https://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2018/12/four-aspects-of-i-am.html
https://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2018/12/two-types-of-nondual-contemplation.html
wrote to someone earlier:
"
The realisation of anatta is crucial to bring that taste of non-dual Presence into all manifestations and situations and conditions without any trace of contrivity, effort, referentiality, center, or boundaries... it is the dream come true of anyone that had realised the Self/I AM/God, it is the key that brings it into full blown maturity every moment in life without effort.
It is what brings the pellucidity and beyond measure brilliance bright of Pure Presence into everything, it is not an inert or dull state of non-dual experience.
It is what allows this experience:
"What is presence now? Everything... Taste saliva, smell, think, what is that? Snap of a finger, sing. All ordinary activity, zero effort therefore nothing attained. Yet is full accomplishment. In esoteric terms, eat God, taste God, see God, hear God...lol. That is the first thing I told Mr. J few years back when he first messaged me 😂 If a mirror is there, this is not possible. If clarity isn't empty, this isn't possible. Not even slightest effort is needed. Do you feel it? Grabbing of my legs as if I am grabbing presence! Do you have this experience already? When there is no mirror, then entire existence is just lights-sounds-sensations as single presence. Presence is grabbing presence. The movement to grab legs is Presence.. the sensation of grabbing legs is Presence.. For me even typing or blinking my eyes. For fear that it is misunderstood, don't talk about it. Right understanding is no presence, for every single sense of knowingness is different. Otherwise Mr. J will say nonsense... lol. When there is a mirror, this is not possible. Think I wrote to longchen (Sim Pern Chong) about 10 years ago.” - John Tan
“It is such a blessing after 15 years of "I Am" to come to this point . Beware that the habitual tendencies will try its very best to take back what it has lost. Get use to doing nothing. Eat God, taste God, see God and touch God.
Congrats.” – John Tan to Sim Pern Chong after his initial breakthrough from I AM to no-self in 2006, http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2013/12/part-2-of-early-forum-posts-by-thusness_3.html
“An interesting comment Mr. J. After realization… Just eat God, breathe God, smell God and see God… Lastly be fully unestablished and liberate God.” - John Tan, 2012
"
"The purpose of anatta is to have full blown experience of the heart -- boundlessly, completely, non-dually and non-locally. Re-read what I wrote to Jax.
In every situations, in all conditions, in all events. It is to eliminate unnecessary contrivity so that our essence can be expressed without obscuration.
Jax wants to point to the heart but is unable to express in a non-dual way... for in duality, the essence cannot be realized. All dualistic interpretation are mind made. You know the smile of Mahākāśyapa? Can you touch the heart of that smile even 2500 yrs later?
One must lose all mind and body by feeling with entire mind and body this essence which is 心 (Mind). Yet 心 (Mind) too is 不可得 (ungraspable/unobtainable).. The purpose is not to deny 心 (Mind) but rather not to place any limitations or duality so that 心 (Mind) can fully manifest.
Therefore without understanding 缘 (conditions),is to limit 心 (Mind). without understanding 缘 (conditions),is to place limitation in its manifestations. You must fully experience 心 (Mind) by realizing 无心 (No-Mind) and fully embrace the wisdom of 不可得 (ungraspable/unobtainable)." - John Tan/Thusness, 2014
- http://www.awakeningtoreality.com/2019/02/the-transient-universe-has-heart.html
"
John TanThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:24am UTC+08
Transmission of the "dharma eye"
Soh Wei YuThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:25am UTC+08
As in direct realization of luminosity?
Soh Wei YuThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:25am UTC+08
Or of anatta etc
Soh Wei YuThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:26am UTC+08
What do u mean by seal
John TanThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:26am UTC+08
It is seeing it alive....that is passed from lineage.
Soh Wei YuThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:26am UTC+08
and how is it different from awareness aware of itself
Soh Wei YuThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:26am UTC+08
Oic
John TanThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:27am UTC+08
Awareness aware of itself soon becomes dead...lol
John TanThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:29am UTC+08
The measure of one's depth is in the ineffability and marvelous manifestation in activity. Anatta and emptiness cannot b dead.
Soh Wei YuThursday, December 12, 2013 at 9:30am UTC+08
I see..
John TanFriday, December 13, 2013 at 9:13am UTC+08
Everytime I go tour, my Awareness just heighten multifold...lol
Soh Wei YuFriday, December 13, 2013 at 9:14am UTC+08
Cool lol ur anatta breakthrough also in korea
John TanFriday, December 13, 2013 at 9:14am UTC+08
Going back tmr
John TanFriday, December 13, 2013 at 9:14am UTC+08
Yeah and Australia
.....
i love this quote by JT
"Awareness aware of itself soon becomes dead...lol
The measure of one's depth is in the ineffability and marvelous manifestation in activity. Anatta and emptiness cannot b dead."
(JT = Thusness, my mentor. I went through same stages as him. I'm Soh btw, co-author of the blog :) )