Posts
[2:13 PM,
6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Actually my experience is always vibrant
presencing.. just a matter of degree.. like getting lost in thought also
affects, not enough shamatha. There are probably some other
obscurations but i dont understand yet
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Yes
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: No mind is a direct insight for me on anatta
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: So what exactly is obscuring is what I m asking u...
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: There is no mind and all is mind simultaneously
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Now if I asked u do u know what DO is all abt?
[2:15 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: If I say A is causally connect to B what is it really talking about? And when I ask A is empty and B is empty and so is the causal connection between them. What does it mean?
[2:15 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Saying they r empty doesn't mean anything at all. What is the insight and wisdom from deconstructing them.
[2:16 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Further I have been asking u what is the purpose of deconstruction?
[2:16 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: And y is view important is deconstruction is everything.
[2:16 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Therefore when u answer andre, ur points aren't clear.
[2:17 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Having insight of anatta is one thing, having insight of DO is another.
[2:18 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Having deconstruction doesn't mean DO. Advaita practitioner deconstruct self, but y they did not c DO? That is the question.
[2:19 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Now, in Tibetan practice, conceptualization is as if the root of all evils but is it? U have to have ur own insights and experiences to authenticate the truth of it.
[2:21 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Y is view important when u need deconstruction? So understand the purpose of deconstruction and understand the view when u have direct insight of anatta to help u.
[2:28 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Advaita subsume everything into one. So their deconstruction leads to collapsing into undifferentiated oneness which has the characteristics of permanence and Self
Whereas buddhism deconstructs Self and sees self and all phenomena like chariot.. so it collapses oneness into multiplicity and then the nature of multiplicity is revealed to be dependent origination and non arising, neither one or many, etc
[2:30 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Subsuming into one, y?
[2:31 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: If deconstruction frees one from conceptualizing, how is it that there's subsuming?
[2:40 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Because after I AM the I AM appears like ultimate reality. So it does not occur to them that the view of subjectivity can be seen through via insight
[2:41 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: They do not even see subjectivity as a view
[2:41 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: To then its the absolute
[2:41 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Them*
[2:43 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Therefore this not seeing is the root of ignorance. So don't see mind or not mind doesn't imply insight.
[2:43 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Ic..
[2:44 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: But for me all observable phenomena are awareness and there is no awareness besides observable phenomena, this is from direct insight
[2:48 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: When one over emphasizes non conceptualization as the ultimate goal, he is letting karmic blind spots sway his understanding.
[2:48 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Oic..
[2:52 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: So as I have said many times, despite having experiences turned effortlessly non-dual and non conceptual post anatta, I m not into no view. Rather I m into direct authentication of right view.
[2:54 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Ic..
[2:58 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: This however is not promoting conceptualization over non- conceptual experience. They support each other.
[3:00 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Why do I ask u what is the purpose of deconstruction? U need to know what exactly does deconstruction achieve. U have deconstructed mind, body and divisions...so what is this deconstruction about and what is the purpose?
[3:02 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Experience presence without boundary and artificial separation or fragmentation
[3:08 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Yes. To access directly presence without intermediary. Having direct access does not mean wisdom and insight will arise. But when u r able to to access the state of non-dual presence, u r able to authenticate the view so that u insight may arise.
[3:09 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Ic..
[3:12 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: So the view, the experience a and the realization.
[3:17 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Now what is dependent origination abt? Is it relation between 2 things? If not what is it pointing at?
[3:26 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: It is pointing to the nature of this presencing appearance.. because we do not comprehend the nature of appearance we come up with the idea that things come into existence and abides somewhere for a moment or a while... but when we look into appearance, appearance is none other than the various conditions exerting, like for example the image on screen is dependent on eye, electricity, etc.. you can’t say it has been created and is locatable somewhere. it is none other than a seamless exertion just like chariot is none other than the parts dependencies functions
It is not relation between two things because the depending and depended are not one or two.. the vision is not vision of its own apart from eye.. eye is not eye on its own apart from vision.. it is the nature of this presencing vision to be dependent and non originating
[8:02 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Quite good.
[8:05 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: But DO must been seen and understood from conventional perspective. How it serves as antidote for the conventional fictions of the mind.
[8:02 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Yeah..
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Yes
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: No mind is a direct insight for me on anatta
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: So what exactly is obscuring is what I m asking u...
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: There is no mind and all is mind simultaneously
[2:13 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Now if I asked u do u know what DO is all abt?
[2:15 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: If I say A is causally connect to B what is it really talking about? And when I ask A is empty and B is empty and so is the causal connection between them. What does it mean?
[2:15 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Saying they r empty doesn't mean anything at all. What is the insight and wisdom from deconstructing them.
[2:16 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Further I have been asking u what is the purpose of deconstruction?
[2:16 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: And y is view important is deconstruction is everything.
[2:16 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Therefore when u answer andre, ur points aren't clear.
[2:17 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Having insight of anatta is one thing, having insight of DO is another.
[2:18 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Having deconstruction doesn't mean DO. Advaita practitioner deconstruct self, but y they did not c DO? That is the question.
[2:19 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Now, in Tibetan practice, conceptualization is as if the root of all evils but is it? U have to have ur own insights and experiences to authenticate the truth of it.
[2:21 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Y is view important when u need deconstruction? So understand the purpose of deconstruction and understand the view when u have direct insight of anatta to help u.
[2:28 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Advaita subsume everything into one. So their deconstruction leads to collapsing into undifferentiated oneness which has the characteristics of permanence and Self
Whereas buddhism deconstructs Self and sees self and all phenomena like chariot.. so it collapses oneness into multiplicity and then the nature of multiplicity is revealed to be dependent origination and non arising, neither one or many, etc
[2:30 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Subsuming into one, y?
[2:31 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: If deconstruction frees one from conceptualizing, how is it that there's subsuming?
[2:40 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Because after I AM the I AM appears like ultimate reality. So it does not occur to them that the view of subjectivity can be seen through via insight
[2:41 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: They do not even see subjectivity as a view
[2:41 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: To then its the absolute
[2:41 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Them*
[2:43 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Therefore this not seeing is the root of ignorance. So don't see mind or not mind doesn't imply insight.
[2:43 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Ic..
[2:44 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: But for me all observable phenomena are awareness and there is no awareness besides observable phenomena, this is from direct insight
[2:48 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: When one over emphasizes non conceptualization as the ultimate goal, he is letting karmic blind spots sway his understanding.
[2:48 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Oic..
[2:52 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: So as I have said many times, despite having experiences turned effortlessly non-dual and non conceptual post anatta, I m not into no view. Rather I m into direct authentication of right view.
[2:54 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Ic..
[2:58 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: This however is not promoting conceptualization over non- conceptual experience. They support each other.
[3:00 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Why do I ask u what is the purpose of deconstruction? U need to know what exactly does deconstruction achieve. U have deconstructed mind, body and divisions...so what is this deconstruction about and what is the purpose?
[3:02 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Experience presence without boundary and artificial separation or fragmentation
[3:08 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Yes. To access directly presence without intermediary. Having direct access does not mean wisdom and insight will arise. But when u r able to to access the state of non-dual presence, u r able to authenticate the view so that u insight may arise.
[3:09 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Ic..
[3:12 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: So the view, the experience a and the realization.
[3:17 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Now what is dependent origination abt? Is it relation between 2 things? If not what is it pointing at?
[3:26 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: It is pointing to the nature of this presencing appearance.. because we do not comprehend the nature of appearance we come up with the idea that things come into existence and abides somewhere for a moment or a while... but when we look into appearance, appearance is none other than the various conditions exerting, like for example the image on screen is dependent on eye, electricity, etc.. you can’t say it has been created and is locatable somewhere. it is none other than a seamless exertion just like chariot is none other than the parts dependencies functions
It is not relation between two things because the depending and depended are not one or two.. the vision is not vision of its own apart from eye.. eye is not eye on its own apart from vision.. it is the nature of this presencing vision to be dependent and non originating
[8:02 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Quite good.
[8:05 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: But DO must been seen and understood from conventional perspective. How it serves as antidote for the conventional fictions of the mind.
[4:05 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: https://youtu.be/BFebcvam2N0
[7:41 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Lol he speaks of the view, experience, realization
[8:01 PM, 6/19/2020] John Tan: Seems like he enjoys the one hand clapping koan. There is no mirror.
[8:02 PM, 6/19/2020] Soh Wei Yu: Yeah..
